Yes exactly. And for some reason it also splits a bit for me? I have written serial killer!Dean. His relationship with Cas is not by any means healthy. It’s manipulative and coercive. But I make it clear from the beginning that Dean doesn’t know better and can’t fully grasp that what he’s doing is wrong and he’s mentally ill. Of course that’s no excuse. It’s still a terribly unhealthy relationship especially when he stalks Cas. For some reason that for me is fine?
I wonder if it’s almost a context thing? Because like, Angel Lust is set in a ‘verse where Jimmy and Sam are both serial killers and they don’t really have any issue with actually murdering people. No one in that ‘verse is exactly stable, but I think b/c I’m writing it with the intent to shock, horrify, disgust, and explore these darker things that I’m able to do it. Is it like that with you? Like you mentioned serial killer!Dean and those kinds of AUs usually have certain reader expectations and conventions, so does that change the ability to write it?
I only wonder b/c if I were to try to present abuse in an AU that turned out happy I don’t think I could.Ah that makes perfect sense! With dark!fic, going in you know there won’t be a happy or even somewhat functional ending and what is a happy ending is still miserable. In my fic, it boils down to a few options and the best is that Cas leaves Dean, gets to safety, recovers, and Dean ends up in prison. They’re both hurt and have their lives destroyed.
I also think that not trying to validate it and trying to make it sympathetic in a dismissive way plays a part too. If the other person’s trauma is dismissed or the behavior is excused, that makes me squick away from it
Oh totally! If you’re reading dark!fic you should probably be aware that it’s not really going to be “happy”. And even “happy” endings are pretty twisted most of the time. (I actually don’t mind a twisted ending if it’s pulled off well. I read a fic a while back where one character was a siren and essentially forced the other into captivity by speaking. It left me with a sinking feeling in my gut and I really enjoyed that because it was horrifying It wasn’t supposed to be a “good” ending and I loved it.) But yeah, even the best option for your fic is devastating.
Also, I agree with you on the invalidation and excuse part. There’s a huge difference between an explanation for behavior and an excuse for behavior. Explanations can make a reader sympathetic towards a character, but it doesn’t make their actions okay. I would like to think most folks understand that, but I’m not sure. And I generally just don’t like when the trauma of one character is brushed off by another.
That sounds like a fic I would enjoy. I love that dark twisting feeling in your gut that would cause. Probably why I love dark!fic and horror so much *lol*. I remember reading a wincestiel fic where the boys were serial killers and killed Jimmy, kidnapped Cas, and they all died. For that story, it fit. There was no one way out other than things getting worse and worse until it suddenly came to a complete halt.
I always wonder about that too. Am I making a character too sympathetic? Can people tell what I’m trying to do with the direction I’m taking it? And especially with what I’m doing with Dean, can the reader pick up he’s slipping and he’s going to start to spiral soon?
lol. I used to watch a buttload of Tales from the Crypt, Twilight Zone, and Tales from the Darkside as a kid, so I love those “and then suddenly everything is awful” twists in horror and suspense. I’ll eat them up. Also that wincestiel fic sounds fun. Do you have the link or remember what it was called? I think it’d be fun to read.
Creating villains with some sympathy but not too much is always tricky imo. I’m one of those people who really enjoys sympathetic villains and redemption though, so it’s an issue for me. There are villains I want to see get eaten by sharks or whatever, but I do tend to pull for the bad guys. I guess they just resonate more with me. Sometimes though, I think it’s fun to keep the reader in suspense. One of those “will they or won’t they” kind of things but it’s will they or won’t they get worse. But I don’t really write a lot of characters that ride moral lines. I’m trying to with my Peacemaker ‘verse, but it’s kind of difficult. I do hope your readers are understanding what you’re doing with Dean, though.
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